Post by Denithar on Oct 2, 2006 0:22:50 GMT -5
This thread is open to any poster, no matter how much knowledge they have on the subject. Just give your opinion.
Could the scenario in this movie really occur? Do you think it is happening somewhere now?
Broky
does anyone think it's possible to happen?! coz unfortunetly, i do… i mean george orewell isn't exactly wrong in 1984 and he was only out by 20 years… that's really scary actually. coz they prejudice against alot that has to do with my family… but yeah- dus anyone actually think it's possible to happen? at such a large scale like that?
Denithar
To a certain extent, it is happening. Bisexual people are mistreated and often killed in strict and radical Muslim countries like Iran. And of course that is just my example, anyone else who commits acts against Allah's will are in peril. It's so weird that everyone focuses on Britain and America. Of course we have problems, but nothing like a lot of places.
Broky***
any which way is annoying… of of mi teachers startd bulllsh!ttin tht there was no such thing as a gay/bi muslim. WRONG!!!! there r LOTS!!! unfortunetly… it's only the radicals that have their voices heard… because they will do anything to have what they have said. read 1984- u'll see what i mean. but the thing with america and britain is that they're much more cosmopolitan- there for they have alot more problems, they admittedly not at such a scale in places like iran. but because there is so much of it- it almost equals up- u see? or am i nt makin sense…?
Denithar***
weeel, I think I got you, but I would say America and Britain get more heat just because they are easier to accuse. If you got the chance, you could call Blair a fool to his face, and he couldn't send his men after you. (You'd probably be hustled out of the building though.) Do that to a Muslim leader, however, and you most likely won't see the next day. America and Britain are easier targets, and though I do recognize that we can be a LOT better, I totally believe that overall we are better than almost anywhere else.
Broky***
hey den- that's a little unfair. i;ve calling pakistani muslim leader's… i think it was "you're a complete jacka$$" on more than one occasion- i'm still here. and they weren't exactly unknown either. the most i got was 'dnt b rude' frm mi mum, who new them some how. and it depends on the leader- suddaam hussain is also an unfair example seeing as it wasn't the muslims who put him up there in the first place- it was the american and british governement unfortunetly. and same goes for usama bin laden- he was a CIA man, with CIA training for russia. and if u say that america and britian r alot better than other places- r u surprised?! they've taken control of places, and left them in that state. luk at pakistan (simpley because that's a country im most familliar with )- the british took over, and closed down all the factories in pakistan so they would have to by over seas. wats more is look at the mess they left with kashmir- it was the british that sorted out which land went where in that dispute, but they didn't sort out kashmir. and now the fighting is still going on.
the real thing is- is that britain and america have it so much better off, that the blame is going to them to make it look like they can sympathise with other countries like these. 11th september happens- suddenly terrorisum is a gr8 big issue that we all must b aware of… when inface suicide bombers and the like have been around for a very long time, jst not in western society.
unfortunetly- i believe that america and britain r alot better than other countries simply by mistakes that have been made in the past. imagine what sort of country india/pakistan could have been if they had not been separated- or even had the land dispute sorted out much longer. with a treaty under their belt, and up and workin factories- it could have been a very powerful coutry. same goes for places like palistine and isreal. if america (im nt sure about any where else unfortunetly- sorry) stopped supplyin them with bombs- their religious/land war would b over very quickly.
Denithar***
No, I do see what you mean, and you have a valid point. And it helps for your argument that you've actually been to Pakistan. And actually, my point is not quite correct, because the point of the film was that it was an oppressive government, but it was a hidden form of oppression, whereas what we're talking about now are countries with blatantly oppressive regimes. So, we're covering too broad a subject now, and it's getting confusing.
But you do have to admit that bisexual people, women, Christians, Jews, etc, have less freedom, and are in varying degrees of danger in many Muslim countries. Now, maybe America doesn't even deserve to be a peaceful, free place. But the point wasn't whether they should be, but whether they are a better place to live than the Muslim countries. I think I would very much rather live in America than, say, Somalia. (Being a Christian, and a Caucasian, I would of course be less comfortable than you would be. But even you, as a woman, wouldn't have the same rights as you do in Britain.)
Broky quoted:
same goes for places like palistine and isreal. if america (im nt sure about any where else unfortunetly- sorry) stopped supplyin them with bombs- their religious/land war would b over very quickly.
How would America stopping from supplying Israel end the conflict? Unless you mean Israel being destroyed by the Muslims that hate them? I know the Palestinians couldn't destroy them alone, but if America didn't stand by Israel then they might very well. (Funny aside fact. If you believe the interpretation of the bible as concerns Israel, it would seem that their state will survive till the end days, so it's fascination for me to see whether they will in fact survive all the hate against them.)
Broky***
as i said b4- it honestly does depend on the muslim country ur talking about. in pakistan- everyone's pretty much equal, gays, bis, women, men, hindus, christans (appart frm u're obvious prejudice idiots that u have everywhere). but some where like afghanistan (and im part afghani) i can see wat u mean. but women r still treated with alot of respect there, and they've come along way- but all the same. though jews rn't as prejudiced as every1 thinks- afghani's declared themselves decended from jews during the world war 2- and many jews fled too muslim countries, to which they were quite welcome.
palistine isn't as rich in weaponary as everyone thinks- i dunno wats happened recently (with the whole kidnapping and bombin and everything) but just a year ago- irealies had alot more weaponary than palistinians. but, like i sed- i dunno wats happened recently. LOL!!! yeah… u got me thinkin now
Denithar***
Mmkay, then I'll recede my argument, since I certianly can't speak with authority on all Muslim countries. I just assumed since the Koran puts women below men that Muslims would follow this code, but I'm very glad to hear that it is not so. (And yeah, the bible kinda does the same thing with women. But I suppose you have to judge a religion by how they act, not by what the books, or some people say. So, basically the same with both religions then. Christians, mostly, have equal status, no matter who they are. And you're telling me that it's the same with some Muslims, so that's awesome.)
yeah, I know. Israel's military is way more powerful than the Palestinian military.
Mighty and handsome mod
Broky and Denithar are asking you!!! What do you think? They do realize that they are very confusing, and lose the topic rather quickly. Post away people.
Could the scenario in this movie really occur? Do you think it is happening somewhere now?
Broky
does anyone think it's possible to happen?! coz unfortunetly, i do… i mean george orewell isn't exactly wrong in 1984 and he was only out by 20 years… that's really scary actually. coz they prejudice against alot that has to do with my family… but yeah- dus anyone actually think it's possible to happen? at such a large scale like that?
Denithar
To a certain extent, it is happening. Bisexual people are mistreated and often killed in strict and radical Muslim countries like Iran. And of course that is just my example, anyone else who commits acts against Allah's will are in peril. It's so weird that everyone focuses on Britain and America. Of course we have problems, but nothing like a lot of places.
Broky***
any which way is annoying… of of mi teachers startd bulllsh!ttin tht there was no such thing as a gay/bi muslim. WRONG!!!! there r LOTS!!! unfortunetly… it's only the radicals that have their voices heard… because they will do anything to have what they have said. read 1984- u'll see what i mean. but the thing with america and britain is that they're much more cosmopolitan- there for they have alot more problems, they admittedly not at such a scale in places like iran. but because there is so much of it- it almost equals up- u see? or am i nt makin sense…?
Denithar***
weeel, I think I got you, but I would say America and Britain get more heat just because they are easier to accuse. If you got the chance, you could call Blair a fool to his face, and he couldn't send his men after you. (You'd probably be hustled out of the building though.) Do that to a Muslim leader, however, and you most likely won't see the next day. America and Britain are easier targets, and though I do recognize that we can be a LOT better, I totally believe that overall we are better than almost anywhere else.
Broky***
hey den- that's a little unfair. i;ve calling pakistani muslim leader's… i think it was "you're a complete jacka$$" on more than one occasion- i'm still here. and they weren't exactly unknown either. the most i got was 'dnt b rude' frm mi mum, who new them some how. and it depends on the leader- suddaam hussain is also an unfair example seeing as it wasn't the muslims who put him up there in the first place- it was the american and british governement unfortunetly. and same goes for usama bin laden- he was a CIA man, with CIA training for russia. and if u say that america and britian r alot better than other places- r u surprised?! they've taken control of places, and left them in that state. luk at pakistan (simpley because that's a country im most familliar with )- the british took over, and closed down all the factories in pakistan so they would have to by over seas. wats more is look at the mess they left with kashmir- it was the british that sorted out which land went where in that dispute, but they didn't sort out kashmir. and now the fighting is still going on.
the real thing is- is that britain and america have it so much better off, that the blame is going to them to make it look like they can sympathise with other countries like these. 11th september happens- suddenly terrorisum is a gr8 big issue that we all must b aware of… when inface suicide bombers and the like have been around for a very long time, jst not in western society.
unfortunetly- i believe that america and britain r alot better than other countries simply by mistakes that have been made in the past. imagine what sort of country india/pakistan could have been if they had not been separated- or even had the land dispute sorted out much longer. with a treaty under their belt, and up and workin factories- it could have been a very powerful coutry. same goes for places like palistine and isreal. if america (im nt sure about any where else unfortunetly- sorry) stopped supplyin them with bombs- their religious/land war would b over very quickly.
Denithar***
No, I do see what you mean, and you have a valid point. And it helps for your argument that you've actually been to Pakistan. And actually, my point is not quite correct, because the point of the film was that it was an oppressive government, but it was a hidden form of oppression, whereas what we're talking about now are countries with blatantly oppressive regimes. So, we're covering too broad a subject now, and it's getting confusing.
But you do have to admit that bisexual people, women, Christians, Jews, etc, have less freedom, and are in varying degrees of danger in many Muslim countries. Now, maybe America doesn't even deserve to be a peaceful, free place. But the point wasn't whether they should be, but whether they are a better place to live than the Muslim countries. I think I would very much rather live in America than, say, Somalia. (Being a Christian, and a Caucasian, I would of course be less comfortable than you would be. But even you, as a woman, wouldn't have the same rights as you do in Britain.)
Broky quoted:
same goes for places like palistine and isreal. if america (im nt sure about any where else unfortunetly- sorry) stopped supplyin them with bombs- their religious/land war would b over very quickly.
How would America stopping from supplying Israel end the conflict? Unless you mean Israel being destroyed by the Muslims that hate them? I know the Palestinians couldn't destroy them alone, but if America didn't stand by Israel then they might very well. (Funny aside fact. If you believe the interpretation of the bible as concerns Israel, it would seem that their state will survive till the end days, so it's fascination for me to see whether they will in fact survive all the hate against them.)
Broky***
as i said b4- it honestly does depend on the muslim country ur talking about. in pakistan- everyone's pretty much equal, gays, bis, women, men, hindus, christans (appart frm u're obvious prejudice idiots that u have everywhere). but some where like afghanistan (and im part afghani) i can see wat u mean. but women r still treated with alot of respect there, and they've come along way- but all the same. though jews rn't as prejudiced as every1 thinks- afghani's declared themselves decended from jews during the world war 2- and many jews fled too muslim countries, to which they were quite welcome.
palistine isn't as rich in weaponary as everyone thinks- i dunno wats happened recently (with the whole kidnapping and bombin and everything) but just a year ago- irealies had alot more weaponary than palistinians. but, like i sed- i dunno wats happened recently. LOL!!! yeah… u got me thinkin now
Denithar***
Mmkay, then I'll recede my argument, since I certianly can't speak with authority on all Muslim countries. I just assumed since the Koran puts women below men that Muslims would follow this code, but I'm very glad to hear that it is not so. (And yeah, the bible kinda does the same thing with women. But I suppose you have to judge a religion by how they act, not by what the books, or some people say. So, basically the same with both religions then. Christians, mostly, have equal status, no matter who they are. And you're telling me that it's the same with some Muslims, so that's awesome.)
yeah, I know. Israel's military is way more powerful than the Palestinian military.
Mighty and handsome mod
Broky and Denithar are asking you!!! What do you think? They do realize that they are very confusing, and lose the topic rather quickly. Post away people.